Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Wild, speculative theories born from the communications with AdjutantReflex.

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jayguy01
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by jayguy01 »

This post clears more issues up. This post here speculates viewtopic.php?f=13&t=359 that the forerunners lived amoungst humans and bred with them, and became the demons that the covenant seem to think we are. The prophets also claim that they are descendants of the forerunner. So perhaps the forerunner lived on all the shield worlds and helped the races develop quickly.
MHYoshimitzu
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by MHYoshimitzu »

Forerunner that bred with humans and became hybrids. They became demons in the eyes of the Covenant because they were impure, or that they were gods who chose to breed with a lesser species, thus becoming debased. That's an interesting way of looking at it.
ChiliDog
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by ChiliDog »

Okay... heres my two cents

The forerunner are out there mucking around in the galaxy populating planets, building cool temples in honor of themselves. One day they stumble across the galactic ebola known as the flood. After many losses the forerunner in their infinite knowledge decide to build the swords (halos), the shields(onyx), and one shield with a razor edge (the ark).

Now in this epic battle between the forerunner and flood something goes wrong, the flood break through the front lines and wreak some havoc. A few forerunner make it into the shield, one lonely soul inside the ark presses the giant big red button and destroys all suitable life (except his own and those inside the shield).

We all know the swords kill off the floods food starving them to death and the shields provide a large habitable environment for the forerunner to hunker down in until all hell is done breaking loose. The key here is the razor edged shield, The Ark. It serves as a remote to fire all the halos at once thus cleansing the galaxy of the flood, also serves as an exit from the shield into a nice cozy planet able to jump start life again, and also store the wealth of forerunner knowledge. In fear of losing all the knowledge they have acquired over the millenia they build these monitors,sentinels, guardians, but mainly adjutant reflex. AR serves as a teacher to help humanity re-learn the forerunners ways (mainly the plight against the flood). After a certain amount of time has progressed after the firing of the halos and humanity again reaches the potential to interperet and understand AR comes out of hibernation and starts to teach (the ARG).

Okay so im gonna try and put this in a time line
1. forerunner expand
2. forerunner find flood
3. forerunner build halos, shields, and ark.
4. flood kill a butt-load of forerunner and they panic, get a few into onyx
5. halos are fired
-time passes-
6. forerunner/ humanity emerges from the shield onto earth via the ark.
-time passes-
7. AR TRIES to get into contact with humanity to teach them about their past (being forerunner)<---this ARG...but something goes wrong.

what that wrong is... is still under debate.

I would like to know what you guys think, but be gentle.
Icy Inferno
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by Icy Inferno »

Just a timeline of a theory I have that's based off of other speculation.

1. Forerunners created the flood as a weapon.

2. Forerunners use flood to kill off other races. Just set em loose on a homeworld, let em kill all the people, the gravemind assimilates all the races knowledge for the forerunners, and then they let the flood on the planet starve until the planet is usable.

3. Forerunners are infected (perhaps they settle a world that they've taken over when the flood weren't completely dead).

4. "Mass sterilization" is required because the flood have broken loose, destroying the forerunners because they now have access to the forerunners ships, allowing them to move. Now that the forerunners have been infected the Gravemind knows that the forerunners were using him, so naturally he fights back.

5. Sheild worlds are hurridly produced to preserve the forerunners who, of course, don't want to die out. The ark and sheild worlds were created so that the forerunners could destroy the flood, then some forerunners could come back and repopulate everything. Halos were originally labs to create and study the flood, but now that they've broken out their failsafe is being ingaged.

6. Forerunners make a run for the sheild worlds and the ark. Everything has gone wrong, and the halos (which were the birthplaces of the flood are now completely overrun) and now the man standing behind the activation of the halos has to make a choice. Gamble that they can make it to the ark, or activate the halos now so that the flood don't control the only weapon that could destroy them. (For example, the "final message" in server five could have been the final message from the guy standing behind the big red button to anyone who had made it to the sheildworlds) (Also, how Guilty Spark makes the comment that the man had asked him if he would do it). In the end, the halos are activated and most, if not all, the forerunners die.

7. The machines built by the forerunners continue to fight the flood and keep samples of the flood so that when the forerunners reclaim what was theirs, they could have something to study so that they could destroy what they had created. A monument to their sins, the gravemind, in left behind.

8. Only those races who were on the planets meant to be sheild worlds survive. And they develop, Covenant is formed, humanity develops, yada yada.

9. When humans reach the halos they are incorrectly classified as the reclaimers. (In Ghosts of Onyx the spartans are originally classified as reclaimers, but are then reclassified when they attempt to communicate with the machine). Master Chief is classified as a reclaimer and Guilty Spark attempts to get him to re-activate the ark because the dumb covenant have run into the flood and are infected. (If you'll remember the flood concentration is so great inside the library. Perhaps they were trying to protect the knowledge of how to destroy the flood.)

10. AR tried to contact humanity so that they could now act as the new reclaimers and stop the flood but either a proud forrunner AI or a flood Ai stopped him.

Essentially thats it for know.
JCannon
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by JCannon »

Perhaps the forerunner was not a species, but a group, much like what we now call the covenant.
The human like creatures, and the modern covenant (minus the elites, we know they came later.) Perhaps a civil war broke out among the forerunner. The covenant like forerunner released the flood in an attempt to wipe out the humans.
The humans fled to their shield world, modern earth, and prepared to fire the halos, the ultimate kamikazie, to destroy the covenant and the flood threat. That could explain why they look like us, and why the covenant hates us.
System Failure
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by System Failure »

JCannon i was thinking the same thing.
Scelus you made me notice something.

[spoiler]In GoO Dr Halsey inquires about when the sentinels arrive and start whippin the Spartan's collective asses.

Quote:
Dr. Halsey's mind raced, connecting the clues: facts from Cortana's log, the stone from Cote d' Azure, the Alien passages and crystal under Reach.
"When precisely, did they appear?" she asked.
" The morning of September 21," Kurt replied.
" That timing coincides with the activation of an alien weapon world- before John thankfully destroyed it. It is no coincidence that the Sentinels appeared then. It must be part of a larger Forerunner plan."

-Ghosts of Onyx ch.20 pg.175

This by it self would show that the ring system planned for people to be in or near the control room of Onyx during the activation of Halo to escape instant death. But after looking at the beginning of the chapter the heading changed my mind.
Quote:
1125 HOURS,NOVEMBER 3, 2552(The rest of heading is irrelevant as of this post

-Ghosts of Onyx ch.20 pg.170
That puts the time between when the Halo system was to be activated and the time the rift would close at 2 weeks (more sevens). So there are 2 possibilities now.

1) The speed of the Halo blast is Slow enough that the "wave" gave you a chance to run, and therefore if we could find the distance that Onyx is from the nearest Halo, we then could then divide that distance by the number of hours in two weeks (336, only 7 away from 343, which is Sparky's number, dont know what that means) and find the velocity of the blast wave, and see how long it would take to cleanse the galaxy. Or

2) The Sentinels got ready for incoming Forerunners when Installation 04 for was activated, but when it was destroyed, they went it to kind of a stand-by mode, killing any thing that is not Forerunner on the planet after taking appropriate samples. Now after the second cancelation of firing, the System went in to failsafe mode, and set the timer of the core. Therefore, if the flood were preventing firings, then some Forerunner could at least live in the Dyson sphere, or if the Forerunners were fighting amongst each other and the Halos were trying to be used as weapons against each other some could still be safe. This would explain why firing got sent to the Ark after two aborted firings. (A) in the event of civil war the firing control, if used repeatedly, would be sent to a specific area, therefore reducing the amount of places that you need to stop people from triggering Halo from 8 sites (7 Halos and possibly the Ark) to just one. Or (B) if the Flood were screwing with the launch sequence, bye having a command center far from where the battle was raging, is all hope was lost the device could still be trigger with relative safety. (Remember our system is on the fringes of the galaxy)[/spoiler]
We killed mostly everything in the galaxy and the older races of the Prophets, and Elites had a grudge with us since then. You never know we might have outranked the prophets then and that might also lead to bitterness on their part. In the Conversations from the universe pamphlet found in Halo 2, an Elite even mentions why we are the only race that hasn't been given a chance to join the Covenant. Surely with all the pillaging and gartering of Forerunner artifacts, the Prophet's would have learned what we did, and learned to hate us.
Ion Predator
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by Ion Predator »

"The installation was specifically built to study and contain the Flood. Their survival as a race was dependent upon it. I am grateful to see that some of them survived to reproduce.

The way I interpret it, through my theory, is that "their survival" refers to the Forerunner. In the beginning, the Forerunner had no choice but to study the Flood in an attempt to create a solution. You can even join the last quote here with this next line to give it a bit more sense: "Samples here were kept after the last catastrophic outbreak... for study; I am grateful to see that some of them survived to reproduce." If we had no samples to study in a lab environment, then we would have no way to get any further in researching the Flood. Guilty Spark is a creature of knowledge; it makes sense that he would want such information available for the Reclaimers to study."

I have heard this theory over and over, and it's always a misinterpretation of grammar.

Summarized, the first line states that Halo was designed specifically for the Flood.

The second line reads: "Their survival as a race was dependent upon it."

If you asks ANY English teacher, they will tell you that the "their" refers directly to the "the Flood." This is simply a basic rule of grammar. If 343Gs was refering to the Forerunners, than the rules of the English language would dictate that he would HAVE to say, "the Forerunners." And seeing as how 343GS is a very intelligent A.I. construct, it's hard for me to believe that he would practice bad grammer. :roll:
ii otnemem ii
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by ii otnemem ii »

Ion Predator wrote:"The installation was specifically built to study and contain the Flood. Their survival as a race was dependent upon it. I am grateful to see that some of them survived to reproduce.

The way I interpret it, through my theory, is that "their survival" refers to the Forerunner. In the beginning, the Forerunner had no choice but to study the Flood in an attempt to create a solution. You can even join the last quote here with this next line to give it a bit more sense: "Samples here were kept after the last catastrophic outbreak... for study; I am grateful to see that some of them survived to reproduce." If we had no samples to study in a lab environment, then we would have no way to get any further in researching the Flood. Guilty Spark is a creature of knowledge; it makes sense that he would want such information available for the Reclaimers to study."

I have heard this theory over and over, and it's always a misinterpretation of grammar.

Summarized, the first line states that Halo was designed specifically for the Flood.

The second line reads: "Their survival as a race was dependent upon it."

If you asks ANY English teacher, they will tell you that the "their" refers directly to the "the Flood." This is simply a basic rule of grammar. If 343Gs was refering to the Forerunners, than the rules of the English language would dictate that he would HAVE to say, "the Forerunners." And seeing as how 343GS is a very intelligent A.I. construct, it's hard for me to believe that he would practice bad grammer. :roll:
Then again, ask any biologist and they will tell you that a virus is not a race. :) Why would the "survival of the Flood matter a BIT to the Forerunner, if they were wiping themselves out to STOP their spread? Boo-yah, logic wins over grammar. :P
The "they" referred to in the last 2 sentences HAS to mean the Forerunner. And, if the second one means Forerunner, that means, upon seeing Master Chief, 343GS recognizes him as looking like the Forerunner and means that humans are Forerunner descendants.

No one in this thread has mentioned this little hole in the thread-starters little time line: We see the Halo3.com/comic starts at 100,000 years ago, which is also when the last time the Halos were fired. So, that excavation that the "gods" are doing in Africa, is that BEFORE or AFTER the firing? If before, then N'chala is friggin' DEAD, and so are all other humans not in some kind of protection (Oh, herrrro Mr. Ark). If after, WHO IS THAT DIGGING? It can't be Forerunner, they were all wiped out! Also, if after, how the eff did N'chala survive the firing?

I would love to think that the books, Sheild Worlds, Dr. Balls-ey, etc. all tied into the game and all, but I don't think Bungie is writing this game (Halo 3 or the Iris ARG) for the book-readers. They are gearing this toward your everyday gamer -- mass-populous. I haven't read the books at all (although I have them, and will read them right after I finish Atlas Shrugged, The Fountainhead, and maybe South of the Pumphouse), and I have been able to keep up with all these discussions/speculations just based on the content in the games. Shield Worlds, Onyx, great, lovely, yeah, but in this ARG, if they come up I will eat my hat.
Icy Inferno
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by Icy Inferno »

Actually, if it was built before the blast I don't see how the humans would be dead...

it seems to me like building an ark before the blast would save the humans.
ii otnemem ii
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Re: Relationship between Reclaimers and the Forerunner.

Unread post by ii otnemem ii »

Icy Inferno wrote:Actually, if it was built before the blast I don't see how the humans would be dead...

it seems to me like building an ark before the blast would save the humans.
Right, that is why I said (emphasis added):
ii OtnemeM ii wrote: If before, then N'chala is friggin' DEAD, and so are all other humans not in some kind of protection (Oh, herrrro Mr. Ark)
The Ark, just as Noah's Ark, was to preserve life in some for or another for re-population. So, then, why didn't the Forerunner preserve themselves? The answer is logical: THEY DID. Humans are the continuation of Forerunner (hence 343GS recognizing MC [and humans, in general] as a product of Forerunner reproduction, as previously stated). Now, whether they grabbed N'Chala himself, we'll find out/or not/who cares. Hell, for all we know, N'Chala went through a GED program, learned English and fired the Halos himself. If fact, since this is the speculation forum, I speculate that he did. So there.
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